So far as I am aware, the IAC competition is the only one for amateur movies
which accepts entries of any length.
The problem for competition organisers is not so much in judging the movies,
though that is a consideration. It is in scheduling the festival or gala
screening at which winners are presented. Even the IAC Festival tends to
put the longest movies on in separate shows in the mini-cinemas (three or
more screening rooms running in parallel.) That means few people risk the
long movie because if they don't like it they are stuck with it, whereas
if they choose a session with several shorter movies the chances are they
will like some of them.
There is a deep-rooted fear of showing extracts from longer works. (I think
there must have been some almighty rows in the past about this.)
What do the brains on the forum suggest? After all if the comp limits are
around 30mins that cuts out quite a lot of drama movies.
Dave (long tall) Watterson
Longer movies
-
Atta Chui
Re: Longer movies
What we could improve, perhaps, is to give out more information about movies.
Advertise them.
People arriving IAC Festival on the day are given a big list of films showing
in 3 mini-camera. You see the name of each film, of the maker, the genre,
the length in minutes.
Then you decide which films you are going to see. Logical?
We can run reviews of some of the films in FVM and on this website.
Atta.
PS. Extract of a long movie? If the filmmaker agrees and does the cutting,
why not?
PPS. If Dave did not recommend Ninja Man, I might not see it last year at
Norwich. The point is that there was no information at the show about the
movie, even though Mark Jackson has a website devoted to the film.
Advertise them.
People arriving IAC Festival on the day are given a big list of films showing
in 3 mini-camera. You see the name of each film, of the maker, the genre,
the length in minutes.
Then you decide which films you are going to see. Logical?
We can run reviews of some of the films in FVM and on this website.
Atta.
PS. Extract of a long movie? If the filmmaker agrees and does the cutting,
why not?
PPS. If Dave did not recommend Ninja Man, I might not see it last year at
Norwich. The point is that there was no information at the show about the
movie, even though Mark Jackson has a website devoted to the film.
-
Ned Cordery
Re: Longer movies
Catching up on things. I agree that long movies have a place in the amateur
world but many festivals/comps exclude them by setting 15 or 20 minute time
limits - this applies to two major amateur festivals here in the USA. For
those attending a synopsis of the films to be shown with clear description
of the content will help. I don't see the point of showing a cut version,
if you do this how can the audience get to see the full version?
Making films with passion!! How very un-British to even suggestion such a
thing. The professional British film industry has had very few directors
who make films with passion, Ken Loach for certain, Ken Russel in his hayday,
can't think of any more at the moment.
Ned C
world but many festivals/comps exclude them by setting 15 or 20 minute time
limits - this applies to two major amateur festivals here in the USA. For
those attending a synopsis of the films to be shown with clear description
of the content will help. I don't see the point of showing a cut version,
if you do this how can the audience get to see the full version?
Making films with passion!! How very un-British to even suggestion such a
thing. The professional British film industry has had very few directors
who make films with passion, Ken Loach for certain, Ken Russel in his hayday,
can't think of any more at the moment.
Ned C
-
Dave Watterson
Passion
Off the top of my head how about:The professional British film industry has had very few directors
who make films with passion, Ken Loach for certain, Ken Russel in his hayday,
can't think of any more at the moment.
Powell & Pressburger
Ridley Scott
Richard Attenbrough
Lindsay Anderson
for starters?
Ned, you missed some discussion of how we might get amateur movies shown
beyond competitions and festivals. There was no easy answer, though some
(impassioned) arguments about the need to get off our backsides and organise
shows. Maybe these are where we could show longer movies?
OR we could consider week-long festivals as some countries do ...
Dave W
-
Ned C
Re: Passion
"Dave Watterson" <david.filmsocs@virgin.net> wrote:
Get films of local interest into the local video store with a feedback request.
Have film days/evenings for local organisations - theatre groups, film societies,
book reading circles, and so on.
Have more and longer festivals!!!
Ned C
The professional British film industry has had very few directors
who make films with passion, >Off the top of my head how about:
Powell & Pressburger
yes
Ridley Scott
I don't think so, very good film maker but no passion, all very calculated.
Richard Attenbrough
Not since "O What a Wonderful War"
Lindsay Anderson
Yes
Some very quick thoughts on getting films shown:Ned, you missed some discussion of how we might get amateur movies shown
beyond competitions and festivals. There was no easy answer, though some
(impassioned) arguments about the need to get off our backsides and organise
shows. Maybe these are where we could show longer movies?
OR we could consider week-long festivals as some countries do ...
Dave W
Get films of local interest into the local video store with a feedback request.
Have film days/evenings for local organisations - theatre groups, film societies,
book reading circles, and so on.
Have more and longer festivals!!!
Ned C
-
Michael Slowe
Re: Longer movies
"Dave Watterson" <forums@theiac.org.uk> wrote:
This is a very important issue in my opinion. I have for long thought that
it is preferable to include an extract of a prizewinner in an award programme
than exclude it altogether.
Sorry for always harping back to the old days of the Ten Best but that was
the perfect example of a well organised and presented competition and they
always preferred the option of excerpts. That way they were able to include
the wonderful USA film school productions that were usually long but unfailingly
of such a high standard that the whole tone of the competition was raised.
Would that these films were entered in our current Festivals but sadly the
stream seems to have dried up.
The extract could be constructed either by or with the producer's approval
and if skillfully done could still contain the essence of the film. Some
may ask "why so long if an excerpt can be effective" but that is another
matter altogether!
Can we please have a comment from an IAC or other festival officer?
Michael Slowe.
Well said Dave (as usual!)So far as I am aware, the IAC competition is the only one for amateur movies
which accepts entries of any length.
The problem for competition organisers is not so much in judging the movies,
though that is a consideration. It is in scheduling the festival or gala
screening at which winners are presented. Even the IAC Festival tends to
put the longest movies on in separate shows in the mini-cinemas (three or
more screening rooms running in parallel.) That means few people risk the
long movie because if they don't like it they are stuck with it, whereas
if they choose a session with several shorter movies the chances are they
will like some of them.
There is a deep-rooted fear of showing extracts from longer works. (I think
there must have been some almighty rows in the past about this.)
What do the brains on the forum suggest? After all if the comp limits are
around 30mins that cuts out quite a lot of drama movies.
Dave (long tall) Watterson
This is a very important issue in my opinion. I have for long thought that
it is preferable to include an extract of a prizewinner in an award programme
than exclude it altogether.
Sorry for always harping back to the old days of the Ten Best but that was
the perfect example of a well organised and presented competition and they
always preferred the option of excerpts. That way they were able to include
the wonderful USA film school productions that were usually long but unfailingly
of such a high standard that the whole tone of the competition was raised.
Would that these films were entered in our current Festivals but sadly the
stream seems to have dried up.
The extract could be constructed either by or with the producer's approval
and if skillfully done could still contain the essence of the film. Some
may ask "why so long if an excerpt can be effective" but that is another
matter altogether!
Can we please have a comment from an IAC or other festival officer?
Michael Slowe.
-
AN
Re: Longer movies
"Dave Watterson" <forums@theiac.org.uk> wrote:
minutes,
a good thing too! I have yet to be gripped/frightened/shocked/hair raised/seat
gripped/seat edge sitting, by any amateur drama. But I have been bored/fed
up/
nodded off/guessed the ending/cringed by many.....
.....OK, just joking....?........?
Albert...making a drama out of a crisis.
.....And judging by the standards of many amateur dramas running over 30So far as I am aware, the IAC competition is the only one for amateur movies
which accepts entries of any length.
The problem for competition organisers is not so much in judging the movies,
though that is a consideration. It is in scheduling the festival or gala
screening at which winners are presented. Even the IAC Festival tends to
put the longest movies on in separate shows in the mini-cinemas (three or
more screening rooms running in parallel.) That means few people risk the
long movie because if they don't like it they are stuck with it, whereas
if they choose a session with several shorter movies the chances are they
will like some of them.
There is a deep-rooted fear of showing extracts from longer works. (I think
there must have been some almighty rows in the past about this.)
What do the brains on the forum suggest? After all if the comp limits are
around 30mins that cuts out quite a lot of drama movies.
minutes,
a good thing too! I have yet to be gripped/frightened/shocked/hair raised/seat
gripped/seat edge sitting, by any amateur drama. But I have been bored/fed
up/
nodded off/guessed the ending/cringed by many.....
.....OK, just joking....?........?
Albert...making a drama out of a crisis.
-
AN
Re: Passion
"Ned C" <loops@fred.net> wrote:
very lucky!),
15 there, and so on. The largest audience I have ever seen is on the final
days
showing at IAC festivals where about 250-300 are present. But to get that
audience you have to be a top prize winner, so that is somewhat restricting.
So, until such time that TV stations give the amateur a look in, we will
never
get 'real' audiences, just odds and ends, here and there.
Albert....ending oddly.
All this is peanuts....an audience of 30 here, 100 there. 200 here(if yourSome very quick thoughts on getting films shown:
Get films of local interest into the local video store with a feedback request.
Have film days/evenings for local organisations - theatre groups, film societies,
book reading circles, and so on.
Have more and longer festivals!!!
very lucky!),
15 there, and so on. The largest audience I have ever seen is on the final
days
showing at IAC festivals where about 250-300 are present. But to get that
audience you have to be a top prize winner, so that is somewhat restricting.
So, until such time that TV stations give the amateur a look in, we will
never
get 'real' audiences, just odds and ends, here and there.
Albert....ending oddly.
-
Ned C
Re: Passion
"AN" <AnimatioN@btopenworld.com> wrote:
of size. Films have no value on the shelf.
Passionate Brit directors
Derek Jarman
John Boorman (?)
Ned C
of 200 who all leave after the showing. But any audience is welcome regardlessAll this is peanuts....an audience of 30 here, 100 there. 200 here(if your
very lucky!),
15 there, and so on. The largest audience I have ever seen is on the final
days
showing at IAC festivals where about 250-300 are present. But to get that
audience you have to be a top prize winner, so that is somewhat restricting.
So, until such time that TV stations give the amateur a look in, we will
never
get 'real' audiences, just odds and ends, here and there.
Albert....ending oddly.
I would rather have an audience of 15 with a discussion than an audience
of size. Films have no value on the shelf.
Passionate Brit directors
Derek Jarman
John Boorman (?)
Ned C
-
Atta Chui
Re: Passion
Quite busy on the forum at Halloween weekend! I have some random responses
added to these…
On Dramatic Films:
Agreed with Albert that amateur dramatic films are often not at par with
commercial films: anyone who had made narrative films know how much work
was involved. Some elements can only be met with money and other resources
(which are brought by money). We (a) don’t have the money and (b) don’t want
to use money to substitute our creativity, decide to meet all obstacles by
stretching our available resources.
The end result is that you just cannot judge a non-commercial film with the
same standard you judge a commercial film. The production value that you
take it for granted all the time are not quite in our films. Note that “production
value” says nothing about how good the film is, but just how expensive the
film is.
Naturally we get poor results if we just grab a bunch of people on the street
and make them watch our films. What will an average audience who grew up
with Hollywood and popcorns think of our films?
On Passion
Well, I am very passionate about my films. I am sure most amateur moviemakers
are too. Why do Dave and Ned C not think so? We all spend a long time planning
the film, we worry about continuity when we shoot, we know jump cut is bad
when we edit, and some of us remember to lay an ambient sound track too.
I think, in many cases, the moviemaker is passionate in the craft of the
filming rather than the subject of the movie. Some are pleased with their
movies because “I can do that too!” Do you have this voice in your heart:
“I really want to tell my audience about this and that”? Or was your last
film “just another exercise for the festival?”
There is nothing wrong about doing an exercise so as to try out your ideas
and sharpen your skill. However, not many moviemakers can break out for this
mode.
added to these…
On Dramatic Films:
Agreed with Albert that amateur dramatic films are often not at par with
commercial films: anyone who had made narrative films know how much work
was involved. Some elements can only be met with money and other resources
(which are brought by money). We (a) don’t have the money and (b) don’t want
to use money to substitute our creativity, decide to meet all obstacles by
stretching our available resources.
The end result is that you just cannot judge a non-commercial film with the
same standard you judge a commercial film. The production value that you
take it for granted all the time are not quite in our films. Note that “production
value” says nothing about how good the film is, but just how expensive the
film is.
Naturally we get poor results if we just grab a bunch of people on the street
and make them watch our films. What will an average audience who grew up
with Hollywood and popcorns think of our films?
On Passion
Well, I am very passionate about my films. I am sure most amateur moviemakers
are too. Why do Dave and Ned C not think so? We all spend a long time planning
the film, we worry about continuity when we shoot, we know jump cut is bad
when we edit, and some of us remember to lay an ambient sound track too.
I think, in many cases, the moviemaker is passionate in the craft of the
filming rather than the subject of the movie. Some are pleased with their
movies because “I can do that too!” Do you have this voice in your heart:
“I really want to tell my audience about this and that”? Or was your last
film “just another exercise for the festival?”
There is nothing wrong about doing an exercise so as to try out your ideas
and sharpen your skill. However, not many moviemakers can break out for this
mode.