Blackmagic Camera

A forum to share ideas and opinions on the equipment and technical aspects of film, video and AV making.
daveswan
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Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:22 am

Blackmagic Camera

Post by daveswan »

OK, who's up for buying one of these?

I know I am, and I think FredD may be too, who else?

And if you are thinking of getting one, have you thought through everything else you might need :shock: ?

SSDs still aren't *that* cheap and raw will fill them up quickly, 500GB/hr roughly.

So, let's see who reply's!

Edited to fix FredD's name :oops:
Last edited by daveswan on Tue Nov 06, 2012 9:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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FredD
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Location: The New Forest, Hampshire.

Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by FredD »

Hi Dave.

It's Fred D. not C :roll:
Yea, my order has been in for a few months. Still waiting. Like you. :cry:

Have got Glass (Primes); Matte Box; Rails; Cage; Follow Focus; SSDs;
Fluid head and sticks; Batteries and Mount; PC to handle RAW and Resolve;
BUT NO CAMERA !
You know the story; have seen you on BMC User forum.

Regards,

Fred D.
"Films are never released, they escape !" Ben Burtt
ned c
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by ned c »

Interesting; I am currently using a DSLR and a Sony VG20 for the "large sensor" effect. However; I feel that neither are suited to "run and gun" shooting as in documentaries where the traditional video camera has the edge. A BMCC or perhaps a Sony 700 may be in my future.

What do you shoot? Narrative; music etc? Examples on Vimeo/TouTube?

Then the learning curve for handling raw in Da Vinci seems to be something of a challenge. The investment is huge in spite of the low cost of the camera body. Meanwhile what happened to the Digital Bolex which it seems to me the BMCC will have killed off; assuming it ever is going to come out. (I was very wrong about the Red camera when I saw a few aluminum castings at NAB and assumed it was not going to happen). Suddenly an influx of very interesting cameras by Canon and Sony no doubt triggered by the impact of the DSLRs and the Red.

By the way; I have very good results with Rokinon prime lenses; relatively inexpensive and very good for the money. They are now making cine versions with the scales on the side and standard gear teeth.

Exciting times.

ned c
daveswan
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Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:22 am

Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by daveswan »

Yep, I'm daveswan on that too.

Some of the negativity has been quite off-putting.

I've to a halfway-decent 'pod and some glass (But not short, a 12mm f/1.6 is on the list!).

Now to build up my storage and look for SSDs

I'll get there bit-by-bit (The same way you eat a computer :D )
daveswan
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by daveswan »

@ned c

I'm doing narrative shorts, in fact my first has its club premier in the 16th, after that I'll put it up for discussion.

I've another two in pre, one will be a sequel that involves a lot of compositing, the other is a comedy heist.

Up to now I've been using a DSLR (550D) but really want raw for compositing.

Most of my serious primes are Leica R, but start too long, I'll be looking at the offerings of SLR Magic and Voigtlander.
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FredD
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by FredD »

"Films are never released, they escape !" Ben Burtt
ned c
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by ned c »

Thanks FredD for the Digital Bolex link. They don't have a camera yet but a special leather case is being designed!!

I spent yesterday shooting for a youngish director and used the opportunity to use only prime lenses. I had to explain that I couldn't "zoom in a bit to tighten the shot" but could either change the lens or move the camera. She was amazed but loved the "look" we were able to get.

ned c
Michael Slowe
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by Michael Slowe »

Those cameras are all very well when you're shooting a narrative film with plenty of set up time for each shot. I find for documentaries where it's 'catch as catch can' most of the time something like the Sony XDCAM EX cameras are far more suitable. If you really need a high MBPS figure you can always record to a Nano box to by pass the camera encoder. Do you really need raw files? I've seen my stuff on a big cinema screen recently and it looked fine, as have broadcasts. For a large sensor camera I would be very tempted by the Sony F3, I don't know how the price compares with the cameras you are discussing. Also, can you get decent audio with DSLR's?
ned c
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by ned c »

Michael; I agree that a traditional camcorder form is the best for documentary and any production where set up time is limited or non-existent.

Shooting with a DSLR is a pain; the shape is all wrong or spend what you paid for the camera for a rig to make it holdable and it's definitely back to double system sound. Why do it? The enormous range of lenses and the control of DoF and yes the results can be stunning. Then there is moire and aliasing; although if set up carefully these can be pretty well eliminated or reduced, be careful what the talent is wearing! The young seem to be in love with DSLRs and I was recently asked by a director to shoot a short using a DSLR and when asked why he didn't have a reason other than it seemed to be the thing.

The new breed of large sensor video cameras are; I think; a direct answer to the DSLR explosion. Yes; the Sony F3 seems to be a good approach and now three more large sensor cameras from Sony. I use the Sony VG20 as an entry experiment to get some experience; I chose the VG20 as my wife uses Sony DSLRs for her still photography and she graciously lets me use her lenses (I do have some of my own!).

The Black Magic camera wasn't out when I made my purchase or perhaps I would have gone down that road as it does record ProRes 422 as well as raw; a much more manageable CoDec for me.

As I said earlier; these are exciting times!

ned c

p.s. to those DSLR addicts out there please spare me from any more time lapse shoots of the stars wheeling overhead and the traffic streaming through the city. You have beaten it to death.
daveswan
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by daveswan »

Coming back.
I've been using a DSLR, but only because my HVX got nicked and the insurance wouldn't pay out (Long story) :evil:
Sound has been double system recorded on a Marantz solid-state recorder, which I'll use when I get my BMC.
Granted the BMC probably isn't the best choice for free-form docco work, but as I'll be using it for narrative I think it will be brilliant once I can handle the footage.

An aside, I'm often bemused by people who want to use quite unsuitable cameras for docco stuff, DSLRs and now the BMC, simpley because it's the "in" thing and they *must* be cutting edge or die.

But even with the BMC's 13 stop DR, you'll still have to light properly if you want your film to "sing"
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FredD
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by FredD »

daveswan wrote:Coming back.
An aside, I'm often bemused by people who want to use quite unsuitable cameras for docco stuff, DSLRs and now the BMC, simpley because it's the "in" thing and they *must* be cutting edge or die.

But even with the BMC's 13 stop DR, you'll still have to light properly if you want your film to "sing"
+1 ! 8)
"Films are never released, they escape !" Ben Burtt
col lamb
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by col lamb »

Perhaps one of you guys could explain precisely why having one of these camcorders is going to help you make better movies?
Col Lamb
Preston, Lancashire.
FCPX, Edius6.02, and Premiere CS 5.5 user.
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ned c
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by ned c »

There are two parts to any art form; craft and creativity: and skill in the craft is the basis of where the creativity goes. Film is different from many art forms in that it is possible to separate he activities of craft and creativity. I am essentially a craftsman who serves the creatives and I like to be able to offer the best possible results that the creatives want and at the same time enjoy my craft and be a part of the creative process. Like a store with a selection of brushes and everything from acrylics to hand ground oils I have the tools that are there to capture and edit the image. Occasionally I do have a burst of creativity and actually originate a project but that is not where my talent lies. I love working in the co-operative atmosphere of production and recognise that this is not for everyone but it suits me.

Craft is all about quality and although even inferior tools in the hands of an expert can deliver; the best tools give the greatest chance of achieving outstanding results. This is why I don't shoot on VHS or Video8.

The video image is a product of a number of technical processes and the lens and the imager are two of the most important. Imager size does matter; those 1/6th inch devices are amazing but very limited. The modern fixed zoom lens is incredible but it limits the the choice and look of what we are recording. The technology is constantly advancing and I like to keep abreast of it

Your question seems strange as I note that you proudly list the specification of your computer and write about the latest computer developments; this too is just a tool so you know what the role of equipment is in film making; it isn't the tools it's the craftsman that matters. There is no replacement for creativity but let's be honest; very few people have it.

You can see some of my work on Vimeo; will you share yours with us?

ned c
daveswan
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by daveswan »

Hopefully the latitude will help avoid burned out skies, while 12 bit raw with DaVinci will give me the scope for creative grading.

Also I think I'll get better keys than with a lousy DSLR, though not as good as a true 4:4:4 cam like an Alexa or Epic, neither of which I can afford.
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FredD
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Re: Blackmagic Camera

Post by FredD »

Colin,
Bless you, but I think you have your head in the sand.
I think Ned has answered your question better than I ever could,
so I won't try to add anything ! :)
Best regards,
Fred D
"Films are never released, they escape !" Ben Burtt
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